Plans for a new rig

[Hex]

Well, as I may have mentioned I get some money through in June for my birthday, and I intend to build a new rig. Components I'm thinking of buying are as follows:

Core 2 Duo E6700 (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?rb=27422540176&action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X3NwZWNpZmljYXRpb25z&product_uid=112703) ~£200
Asus Striker Extreme mobo (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=126240) ~£200
Corsair 2x1Gb XMS2 DDR2 800 Mhz (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=98711) ~£200
BFG 8800GTX 768Mb (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=125331) ~£350
2x Seagate 500Gb SATA HDDs (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=97633) ~£75 each
Liteon SATA DVD-RW 20x (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=127442) ~£30
Tagan 700W PSU (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=125620) ~£100
Antec P182 Case (http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/126946) ~£100

This lot at ebuyer prices will cost ~£1300. I'm prepared to fork out this much cash but obv I don't wanna waste money, so does anyone see anything on this list that is a vast waste of cash? For instance the memory seems kinda expensive compared to some other options

[Sid]

-Buy 2x1GB GeIL PC6400C4 (4-4-4-12) for about £90 instead.
-You don't need a 700W power supply. A 500W Tagan would be more than sufficient.
-Might be best going for a ~£200 graphics card then just selling it and buying another £200 card in a year or so rather than buying a £350 you won't see any difference from.
-I wouldn't spend £200 on a motherboard. Buy a £120 one from Abit/Asus.

[Hex]

Good call on the memory and the mobo. PSU is maybe OTT aye. My plan with the graphics card is rather than sell it in a year, buy an identical one and SLI them in a year; still it seems I can get an 8800GTS 320MB for about £200 which is only 100Mhz or so slower. Thanks for the ideas :-)

[YegaDoyai]

Yeah, definately stick with the 700, you will need a 500 with those components so it is better to have the headroom for better stability, +1 for the geil. Again, I would invest in a good mobo so the one you have chosen is good, but I'd be reading up LOTS on its rivals to make sure you are definately getting the right one. I simply can't reccomend the P180 highly enough and all the changes to the P182 make me want to buy another one. BUT it is a heavy mother fucker. Like REALLY heavy.

Also you have not mentioned your aftermarket cooling solution which you should purchase, but I'll save you the effort and tell you that the Tuniq tower 120 is the best currently available and costs about £35. Should cool about 50% cooler than stock @ 50% noise reduction plus is the quietest and coolest non watercooling/phase change cooler.

[Hex]

I simply can't reccomend the P180 highly enough and all the changes to the P182 make me want to buy another one. BUT it is a heavy mother fucker. Like REALLY heavy.

Also you have not mentioned your aftermarket cooling solution which you should purchase, but I'll save you the effort and tell you that the Tuniq tower 120 is the best currently available and costs about £35. Should cool about 50% cooler than stock @ 50% noise reduction plus is the quietest and coolest non watercooling/phase change cooler.

Heh, the heavy factor doesn't matter as I would only ever move it in order to come to a LAN, and I have a car :-)

As for cooling, I was gonna buy one of the Zallman flower coolers you recommended me a while back, whats the performance difference like? The Zallman flower would be about £20 less.

EDIT: Just been looking into mobos, and while the Striker Extreme is expensive its gotten good reviews and has a lot of neat features, so I think I'll probs stick with that choice unless anything amazing is released over the coming month. Now I've just gotta decide on a GFX card...

[YegaDoyai]

performance is pretty huge, the Tuniq is cooler and quieter across the board. The flower cooler no longer cuts it (unless you get the 9700 which is 3-4th best cooler)

[Muppet]

Quieter if you keep the fan under ~40%, otherwise its a monstrous beast. Then again, its such a good cooler the thing doesn't even need a fan.

However, noise provides no problem for me when building a pc - i sleep through it no problem.

[Hex]

Fair do's, i'll grab me a tuniq tower then :D mmmmm can't wait to build this

[LastChanceHotel]

we all know what Hex is really going to buy.

http://mymacbuzz.com/wordpress/media/2006/ms_DSC00177.jpg

Predictable mac joke aside, I think the motherboard is overpriced (but then again, it may have something particularly amazing on it). Does it allow you to unlock the multiplier?

It seems you can pick up perfectly respectable (but non 680i) boards for sub-£80 with SLI. Would you not be better splurging the money on a GTX?

Good call on the Zalman. Although, if you can get your greasy paws on a Panaflo 120mm fan or two - a Thermaltake si-120 or whatever the C2D variant is called is a sound investment.

[Hex]

Predictable mac joke aside, I think the motherboard is overpriced (but then again, it may have something particularly amazing on it). Does it allow you to unlock the multiplier?

It seems you can pick up perfectly respectable (but non 680i) boards for sub-£80 with SLI. Would you not be better splurging the money on a GTX?

Good call on the Zalman. Although, if you can get your greasy paws on a Panaflo 120mm fan or two - a Thermaltake si-120 or whatever the C2D variant is called is a sound investment.

The motherboard is a touch pricey, but essentially its just got every bell and whistle you could possibly ever want. Bit-tech have a review here (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2007/01/24/asus_striker_extreme/1.html) if you want the details. Essentially I have a larger budget than usual and want to splurge on really quality components.

As for the fans, Panaflo fans appear to be difficult to obtain this side of the atlantic - the only UK site I've seen em on so far is Scan and they only have the 80mm variety. The P182 case comes with 3 tricool 120mm fans built in, is it worth replacing these? I think theres room for a further 2 120mm fans but again, is it worth adding yet more cooling? as for the Thermaltake si-120, I can't actually find the product you're referring to...but is it any better than the tuniq tower?

[YegaDoyai]

No, NOTHING beats the Tuniq except phase or water cooling.

[Sid]

Yeah, definately stick with the 700, you will need a 500 with those components so it is better to have the headroom for better stability

I reckon he'll use around 350W.

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=36066

[YegaDoyai]

normal usage I'd agree he'll use about that power, peak he'll be breaking the 400W mark and that is why a 500 PSU is a good choice, add in a second power hungry graphics card and a second 1TB HDD and you get your magic 600 (needed, not used) figure, but as the price difference between a 600 and 700 is marginal and a 700 is designed for higher load therefore should run cooler/quieter ovreall the 700W PSU is a sound investment and should be able to stay as part of the computer as long as the case does. I run a 420W PSU in my Sempron and would be happy to upgrade to a dual core setup but not with anything more than 1 HDD and a mid spec graphics card because if I try for more I will push the boundary of my PSU however, when this machine retires I expect that PSU to handle my second machine for a lifetime as it will clearly have enough power to provide for any normal setup.

It should be noted that Hex spoke to me at the LAN about his next build and while we all know 'future proofing' is pointless this build has less restrictive budget concerns than most and when that tag is lifted I'd rather build in an extra margin or error, going for the products with longer waranties etc.

[Hex]

It should be noted that Hex spoke to me at the LAN about his next build and while we all know 'future proofing' is pointless this build has less restrictive budget concerns than most and when that tag is lifted I'd rather build in an extra margin or error, going for the products with longer waranties etc.

Yeah, to clarify essentially I inherit about £2000 when I turn 21 on the first of June. My idea is to spend anywhere between £1000 and £1500 on a new PC which is *reasonably* futureproof. I have a tendancy to upgrade my PC with extra devices at a whim (second gfx card, extra harddrives, physics card if they take off, etc etc) so the 700W PSU is just to allow for this. Equally the mobo is relatively futureproof - its Quad core compatible and it can handle FSB speeds not yet adopted on any scale. Equally it can take up to 8GB of RAM. So essentially I've got a bit of room to upgrade the unit rather than having to ditch the lot when I want more power. Equally things like the case, DVD-RW and PSU are gonna be good for a long time, even if I wanted to replace the CPU/RAM/mobo/GFX I could still keep the case, PSU etc if I buy good ones now.

While we're on the subject, recommendations for a flat panel monitor? Its really time I ditch the crappy 15" CRT I have at home, I was thinking somewhere in the region of 20"

[Fyndir]

flat panel monitor? Its really time I ditch the crappy 15" CRT I have at home, I was thinking somewhere in the region of 20"

I have to let my own experience shine through here and tell you about the lovely-ness of the ViewSonic that I have (so do a few other people at the LANs though. =P), it's rather nice. (http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/101080)

I don't know if there are better ones with better prices out there, but I think it's rather nice. =D

Overclockers don't seem to stock it any more though, or not that I could see anyway. =S

[Hex]

I have to let my own experience shine through here and tell you about the lovely-ness of the ViewSonic that I have (so do a few other people at the LANs though. =P), it's rather nice. (http://www.ebuyer.com/UK/product/101080)

I don't know if there are better ones with better prices out there, but I think it's rather nice. =D

Overclockers don't seem to stock it any more though, or not that I could see anyway. =S

Looks nice, the price is right too :-D Ebuyer has no specs other than the maximum resolution, I take it it supports decent refresh rates etc

[YegaDoyai]

No such thing as refresh rates for TFTs, it's not like the TV anyway, as budget is less of a consideration you might want to spend a bit more and get a bit more. Pixie did some research a while back that you could search the forum for. No doubt there will be newer versions but the same line should still be as good.

Edit:

I think it was this line that pixie identified as the best but I'm not 100%

http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/search/?strSearch=&bolShowAll=true&intStoreID=66&intCatID=12&intSubcatUID=763&intMfrID=51&bolShowAll=true

[Hex]

hmmm well the monitor fyndir suggests does seem like a good buy. The problem with spending more is that as the price goes up, it becomes more and more difficult to get a non-widescreen display, and frankly widescreen is a pain in the ass because so few applications support the correct resolutions. Source has good Widescreen support, but plenty of games (e.g. BF2) don't support it at all, and 1024 stretched into 1400x900 looks like crap....Had a quick look for pixie's research (can't say I did an exhaustive search) and couldn't find anything other than a thread announcing that he'd bought the same display Fyndir suggested. My mate andy bought a dell display which uses the same panel as apple cinema displays (which are rather gorgeous) but is less money, he seems very happy with it. Again though, widescreen format...We've got a month til I actually buy anything so feel free to suggest away essentially :-D

Edit: just seen your edit, that does look like a nice option. I'll see how the total budget is weighing up and decided where to save and where to splurge I guess.

[YegaDoyai]

The dell 2007FP is one of the best monitors I've seen, my dad got one from work so it was the right price but it is not as good as the 922. The 922 (if you look at my previous posts) is a fantastic monitor.... at that price. There are better and I'd expect your monitor to outlive your current build so spending now is saving later. If you can't find anything conclusive on any particular monitor out there then I'd reccommend the Dell over the NEC and Viewsonic over the Dell only if you REALLY need to save the cash as the DELLs extra res and size make it a better all round monitor (once you try a 1600*1200 display you won't want to go back, gaming and working alike)

[Hex]

Yeah found the dell 2007FP, has sweet reviews and looks mightily tasty but its almost twice the price of the Viewsonic 922. I'll see how the budget is going when I start actually purchasing components and make a decision then. Thanks for all the suggestions :-D

[Uuurrahh]

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That is all. Yes Hex, your ASCII penis is deformed. I'm lazy. Call it conceptual.

[YegaDoyai]

Wtf? I have no idea why you think this is relevent or if you are pro widescreen or not.

[Hex]

Euan......lets keep it on topic eh?

Wtf? I have no idea why you think this is relevent or if you are pro widescreen or not.

Well at a guess he's pro widescreen - the ascii knob is bigger for widescreen

[Fyndir]

Wtf? I have no idea why you think this is relevent or if you are pro widescreen or not.

I think he was saying that Widescreens are the same as having a bigger penis, which is to say that they're better.

It made sense as long as you turn off about 150 IQ points and think like a Turkeyboy. =P

[Hex]

Right, enough discussion of Euan's sick ASCII fetishes, lets have no more posts about it. Seriously, I don't 4 pages of "ROFL its a knobend" style posts....

[Uuurrahh]

pfft. Anything ascii is by far more interesting than just saying "I recommend you look into widescreens as they pwn."

As I said to Fyndir - the logic is in-phallible and you know it.

[YegaDoyai]

ROFL

turkeyboy > fyndir

[LastChanceHotel]

Widescreen is the way to go, and you should set yourself a 22" + widescreen minimum.

I have a 1680x1050 23" "Fujitsu Siemens" widescreen, which is 16:10, and it kicks ass. You -will not- go back to smaller screens voluntarily once you have a large widescreen.

Speaking of game support, the monitor will scale most games comfortably to its widescreen format. It looks a little funny for an hour or two, but soon enough you don't notice it. If it's a real big sticking point, patches are available for most games (and are well, well worth it) that don't support it (BF2 is the only one that springs to mind - Hell, live for speed supports it!)

I paid £250 for this thing, which in hindsight was a steal. Here's some specs you'll be looking to beat:

1680x1050 resolution
16:10 widescreen aspect ratio
1000:1 contrast ratio
5ms response time

£250 from PC World! My god!

Jan

[Hex]

Well this Samsung SM-226BW (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-050-SA&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=) looks pretty tempting:

- Viewable Area: 22” Widescreen (1680x1050 Resolution)
- Interface: Analog / Digital
- Response Time: 2ms
- 16.7M Colours
- Contrast Ratio: 3000:1
- Viewing Angle (H/V): 160°/ 160°
- Brightness: 300cd/m2
- 3 Years On-Site Warranty with Samsung

Overclockers price - £258.49 inc VAT

Unless I'm missing something, that is a fucking steal. Similar monitors seem to go for almost twice that on ebuyer....

Interestingly PC World sell this HP Monitor (http://www.pcworld.co.uk/martprd/store/pcw_page.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@0874910503.117813833 6@@@@&BV_EngineID=cccgaddkldljldecflgceggdhhmdgmk.0&page=Product&fm=null&sm=null&tm=null&sku=504559&category_oid=-27763) - not quite as good spec but £250 inc VAT.

[YegaDoyai]

You get what you pay for.

[Hex]

Whats that supposed to mean :? Is it a good deal for a monitor or what?

EDIT: Just read the bit-tech review of this monitor here (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2007/03/15/Samsung_226BW/1.html). Seems like exactly my kinda monitor tbh...well done Jan you've sold me on the Widescreen aspect ratio!

[YegaDoyai]

I meant it's not a good deal it's just not a very good monitor. Jan monitor (and euans) are great for work but both have to much ghosting for gaming as a principle monitor in my opinion. I'm currently using an 8ms HP monitor and it is ok, but I wouldn't want to use it full time. Dads Dell is much the same, the 922 has no ghosting that i've seen nothing anyone has at the lans compares favorably to it. When you go to a 22" widescreen you lose a lot of uniformity in lighing and the colour control and resonse times are never as good. I'd love to have one for work but they are still not a 'gaming' monitor. The reason I support the Dell is that it is a good compramise as it's colour rendition, resolution and response time mean it is good at them all, even if it does cost a bit.

not the best review I've ever seen, checkout anandtech and tomshardware, they both did roundups last summer (and I think updated them in the winter) with far more indepth coverage and better explanation on thier conclusions.

[Uuurrahh]

I meant it's not a good deal it's just not a very good monitor. Jan monitor (and euans) are great for work but both have to much ghosting for gaming as a principle monitor in my opinion.

Ghosting was a concern but I've never really been one to notice it so it's never bothered me. So if it affects me negatively, I can't particularly tell anyway. Plus the games I play aren't usually amazing twitchfests so it works out just fine.

[Hex]

Hmmm...well if the Viewsonic 922 is so good, what about Viewsonic widescreen models from the same series (VX) such as the VC2235WM (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?rb=27458964128&action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X3NwZWNpZmljYXRpb25z&product_uid=120826)? Thought I was onto somit with that Samsung, it looks awesome on paper :-(

[Strings]

Just my 0.02, but I'd bet you wouldn't notice any ghosting tbh. Just hammer the reviews, if it gets thumbs up, then go for it.

[LastChanceHotel]

You won't notice the ghosting, unless you like expensive CRTs (and most people don't, after using a TFT).

That 22" is a good monitor at a good price, but it's a little small :D Still, for that price - go for it.

There's no real catch, it's a pretty good monitor. 2ms is excessive, you lose colour accuracy and uniformity when manufacturers go towards speed (three sided triangle: cost, speed, quality) unless you pay out the ass.

[YegaDoyai]

Don't listen to these ballbags, go to PC World or something and ask for a demo if you can't see the ghosting then sure go with it, however, I can see ghosting and it bugs me when I'm looking into the apex and it is blurred through ghosting. The 2ms G2G means squat, go check the anandtech article on screen response times.

This just in, Intel are releasing a new chipset on the 21st, rumour has it that it will be sweet. Check my thread when I've got enough info to post.

[Hex]

Don't listen to these ballbags, go to PC World or something and ask for a demo if you can't see the ghosting then sure go with it, however, I can see ghosting and it bugs me when I'm looking into the apex and it is blurred through ghosting. The 2ms G2G means squat, go check the anandtech article on screen response times.

Sadly PC world don't stock the samsung model I flagged earlier. However my mate Andy has a Dell 22" widescreen (not sure of the model) so I think I'll take my laptop round to his at some point and boot CS:S onto it, see if it suffers from ghosting as you suggest the Dells do...I'm not overly convinced I would notice ghosting even if it was present....I'm also not entirely sure I understand what you mean by the term! I assume you mean a "ghost" of a previous image lingering and obscuring the current picture.

[YegaDoyai]

Rememnber that the 2007#### model is quite alot better than other dell models.

[Hex]

So, thoughts on the 2007WFP (http://accessories.euro.dell.com/sna/productdetail.aspx?c=uk&l=en&s=dhs&cs=ukdhs1&sku=59233)? 16ms response time seems a bit low compared to the usual. See what I need is a big shop full of monitors that I can play CS:S on before buying them.....Still really tempted by the Samsung one I flagged earlier, if anyone knows of a shop where I can try this out PLEASE let me know.

[YegaDoyai]

the 16ms is more representative of the monitors overall ability to switch, granted it is not as fast as the 922 across the board or as good as the Samsungs G2G but it will perform at that speed across almost all colour changes and that uniformity means better movie and moving picture response. Like I said it's an excellent work monitor and a good movie monitor. It's on a par with the 22" widescreens for gaming. (ie sub par)

To be honest the best way to see the Dells is to go to work, dell are no longer in shops bu obviously have a HUGE following in the business world. Go speak to your computing department about where the latest computers are (not nesscearily for students) and ask if you can have a looksie.

[Hex]

OK dude, so far you've pretty much pointed out the flaws in every monitor I've stumbled across. Can you recommend me a widescreen monitor (approx 20-22") that is, in your opinion, good, as opposed to OK? I wanna make a well-informed choice here but so far I only have information regarding which monitors I shouldn't buy rather than which I should....

[LastChanceHotel]

Can you recommend me a widescreen monitor (approx 20-22")

go up to 23", there are some interesting panels up in that range (the one in my one for example) that are still within that price bracket. Well, at least I think you should consider going up to 23".

This one looks shit hot for the price:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-006-BE

This one is even hotter, but contains a larger price tag for what I would consider an unneccassary 'improvement':
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-004-AS&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

This one looks sexier and is less likely to explode than #1, but costs more because it's a dell:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-015-DE&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

...and this is the one you want. :D
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MO-009-DE&groupid=17&catid=510&subcat=

If you play games on your machine for less than 50% of the time, you don't need a TFT that is ludicrously fast - 6ms will do most people just fine. Counter-Strike Source on my one (5ms) works just fine, with no noticeable issues of ghosting.

In my experience, the only real problem you'll have with a monitor with that high a resolution is you'll hardly be able to see the details during games unless it's about a foot and a half away from your eyes! Hence, it's a very sensible idea to get the most physically big monitor you can, in order to make it more readable.

Jan

[Hex]

If you play games on your machine for less than 50% of the time, you don't need a TFT that is ludicrously fast - 6ms will do most people just fine. Counter-Strike Source on my one (5ms) works just fine, with no noticeable issues of ghosting.

In my experience, the only real problem you'll have with a monitor with that high a resolution is you'll hardly be able to see the details during games unless it's about a foot and a half away from your eyes! Hence, it's a very sensible idea to get the most physically big monitor you can, in order to make it more readable.

Jan

My desk is about a foot and a half from back to front, so thats pretty ideal lol. The Dell Ultrasharp 2407 looks very very nice....I'll have to see if I can stretch to that sort of money. Tbh I'm still liking the Samsung, excellent specs for what seems like the right amount of money, and all the customer reviews peg it as an excellent monitor, no ghosting, no dead pixels etc etc. This is gonna be a tough choice :-?

[Fyndir]

List of monitors

It's worth noting that Jan said that the one you want is the only one which is shown with a lady type on the screen.

Coincidence? I think not.

[Hex]

It's worth noting that Jan said that the one you want is the only one which is shown with a lady type on the screen.

Coincidence? I think not.

lol, in that case Jan should love this one (http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2007/03/15/Samsung_226BW/4.html)

[YegaDoyai]

yeah the 23" market does seem to be a bit better (something to do with the size of the overall wafer) anyhoo. The ultrasharp has had nothing except good reviews but again. Beyond 19" you will only get ok gameing performance. Other than that the Ultrasharp is a beast of a monitor but at that price would you be better off with twin 922s?

[LastChanceHotel]

Many thanks to Jennifer Morrison, star of TV's House and EA's Command & Conquer 3, for helping us demonstrate the 226BW's excellent image quality.

I think you should get two Samsungs.

[Hex]

It was mentioned in one of the other hardware threads that the P182 features the ability to stick the cables down the back of the motherboard plate, thus tidying the case up. Of course, this is gonna result in needing lengthier cables/cable extensions. The question in, what cables would it be feasible/sensible to route this way? I.e. what extensions do I need to track down. I've already found extensions for the mobo power connectors on overclockers.co.uk, would it be worth buying molex/sata power extenders as well?

EDIT: Ok just thought that through and remembered the PSU sits at the bottom of the case in the P182, I'm not used to this setup lol. Obviously routing the drive cables all the way round the back of the mobo would be incredibly dumb.....

[YegaDoyai]

Like I said, on my PSU the cables are all large enough to route to everything except the top drive bay. There are two routes the cables can take behind the MOBO tray, one to the top of the tray and one directly to the drives. So it should all be fine.

Btw have you looked at the new P35 chipsets? Very tasty

[Hex]

P35 chipsets are no use to me as I wish to have support for SLI. I'm sure we discussed this before, no? If I want SLI, I need an nVidia chipset...

[YegaDoyai]

yeah, I'm just not so sure you want to go down the Nvidia route for the right reasons :)

[Hex]

Well the mobo i've picked out gets great performance + I've always used nVidia cards and never had any trouble with em. If nothing else AMD are looking somewhat up shit creak, and they own ATi - not sure I wanna buy cards from a potentially doomed manufacturer!

[YegaDoyai]

It's not like they are gonna dissapear in the lifetime of a graphics card.

[Hex]

It's not like they are gonna dissapear in the lifetime of a graphics card.

Stranger things have happened my friend. Besides, whats wrong with the nVidia route that I propose to take?

[YegaDoyai]

Too sheeplike for my preference is all.

[Hex]

Rigggggggght, so what outlandish, un-"sheeplike" setup are you proposing exactly? Allegations of "following the herd" as it were only really apply when what the majority are doing is incorrect, in this case SLI setups are popular because they are damn good! I mean if you can come up with a convincing argument that states I could get a better setup for less money by going with a different setup then fire away, but I suspect what you'll find is that I get a very similar setup (performance-wise) for a very similar amount of money...

[YegaDoyai]

The P35 is supposed to be better in the following areas:
Lower power consuption
Less Heat generation
Overclocking (simpler)
Features (DDR3 memory support)

The ATi solution is supposed to be better for the following (unproven as yet but we only have to wait till next week to find out):
Lower power consuption
Price/performance ratio
Better scaling

The Intel/ATi solution is therfore better:
Lower power consuption
Less heat generated
Better scalability
Better price performance

I genuinely think that going the nVidia route is the cop out route. You are not taking any risks and you are ensuring the market share dominance that may lead to a monopoly. As a capable and interested user you should be ble to handle the switch to ATI and all that that entails (learning how it's 3d app preference settings works). The more I read about the upcoming tech the more I think that ATi have a 'better' if not faster solution to the current and more directly next gen titles. The X2### will, IMHO, be better at next gen tasks than it's 8800 brethrin, relatively.

[Hex]

You make an interesting point, but it's all based on "supposed to" rather than "does". However, I am not buying the rig until June, so if I read favourable reviews of these products when they materialize, I may yet be convinced to change my plans. We can but wait and see ;)

EDIT: Just read this (http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=34446). Yes, I know it's six months old, and I have no idea if it's even remotely reliable, but if it's true then it throws your claims of lower power consumption out the window. Feel free to point out any evidence to the contrary, as I say I'm unsure of this article's validity.

[LastChanceHotel]

You make an interesting point, but it's all based on "supposed to" rather than "does". However, I....zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz*headdesk*

Why not just consult Tomshardware nearer the time, and spare us the to-ing and fro-ing, when times are still changing?

[Hex]

Why not just consult Tomshardware nearer the time, and spare us the to-ing and fro-ing, when times are still changing?

Because Jan, this is a discussion between two interested parties. Not interested? Don't read the thread....

[YegaDoyai]

Yeah, the R600 was oringinaly scheduled for 90nm process but the delay is rumoured to be because they are shifting to a 65nm process therefore reducing the power and heat requirements of the card. However, I'm not sure how much of that is wishful thinking.

[Hex]

Just been having a quick look around and I can't find a P35 based mobo which really compares with the Striker Extreme that I'm gonna buy should I go with the nVidia cards. The only one I can find that looks comparable is the Asus P5K3 Deluxe (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=MB-237-AS) which looks shiny. Main downside to this one is that it only supports DDR3 RAM, which would cost me a fair bit more than the DDR2 for the Striker. Plus having looked around, DDR3 RAM doesn't actually appear to be available yet! OCuk have a single entry for DDR3 which is a pre-order item, and 2GB of Corsair DDR3 will cost £300 including VAT - the words 'fuck' and 'that' come to mind. Unless I can find a mobo that rivals the Striker for features, I'm sticking to me original plans, regardless of how shiny the 2900XT turns out to be

[Hex]

Sorry for the double post, but noone will notice an edit in an inactive thread. Just wondering if it's worth spending the extra few quid on some replacement drives to avoid using IDE altogether. My plan was to use the single IDE port on the mobo I'm gonna buy for a 40Gb IDE HDD (linux partition) and a DVD-ROM drive. However I could pick up a SATA 40Gb HDD for less than £20 and a SATA DVD-ROM drive for about a tenner. Reckon it's worth spending the extra to keep the cabling neat?